Hey Everybody! I am so proud of you guys! Your discussions have been tremendous. I am especially happy that so many of you have jumped in with us late and gone back to the very beginning, signed in, and added your answers to the previous weeks of our book discussion. Way to go! As we moderate, we give the same attention to the comments on the older posts as the ones that are up-to-date. I promise you that community and active discussion will make your journey far more meaningful and hold you infinitely more accountable.
Ok, we’re about to get to a part of the book that I found highly interesting in research. The next several chapters involve the insights from the men’s survey and I bet a few of their comments will pop your eyes open, too. In the mix of what we have ahead, we’re going to be focusing on men-related insecurities then soon after that (in coming chapters) we’ll focus specifically on women-related insecurities. Each of us has a tendency to be less secure around one gender than the other and, according to the survey of over 900 of you, we’re almost evenly divided between the two. I pray we’re going to gain insight into some gender-related insecurities and stumble upon some much needed freedom. I really want you to read the portions about the men even if you don’t have a mate or a specific man in your life. If we have resistant, resentful hearts toward men, we can’t just avoid them altogether. They comprise the other half of our population so it really is imperative in our pursuit of wholeness that we get a grip.
Your assignment for this week is to read CHAPTERS 10 AND 11 and answer the following question:
1. Based on Chapter 10, in all truthfulness, has your historical tendency been to view men (generally speaking) as gods? Or devils?
2. Based on Chapter 10 and your own day-to-day observances, what differences do you see between men’s insecurities and women’s?
3. On p.208 in Chapter 11, I suggest that women who struggle with insecurity tend to be particularly taken with 2 divine attributes: omnipotence and omniscience. Did either of these resonate with you? If so, how?
We are liable to have some LIVELY conversation this week! I can’t wait to see it happen! Just one little thing I want to throw out there: some of you may have some pretty big hang-ups with men because you have a background of abuse like I do. If it plays heavily into one of your answers, by all means, share what pertains but I’ve learned along the way that it’s best to stop short of graphic descriptions. Most people have a hard time knowing what to do with those kinds of mental images. I’ve told every graphic detail in counseling situations but, publically, I try to stay general. It’s just too much for most listeners and readers. They have compassion but they just don’t have the answers. We know Who does.
Go for it, Girls! I’m so honored to take this journey with you.
Anonymous 
I must share w/you my Sweet sisters in Christ, I can feel as I read these posts the chains shattering all around us. May Your strength Oh Lord fill our hearts and homes as we deal with our inner demons and pasts. May you Oh Lord bless our families and children that they remember only Your blessings!! Thank you Lord for hearing us and blessing our lives and families!! For "You have turned my wailing into dancing; you removed my sackcloth and clothed me with joy, that my heart may sing to you and not be silent. O Lord my God, I will give you thanks forever." Ps 30:11-12.
First, that whole bit about eating from the tree of knowledge of good & evil…I have never viewed it in that light…amazing!
1. I might have the worst set of glasses here. I believe I view men as 'should be' gods but dump them because I think they're 'would be' devils…going out of my way to find things wrong w/ them. (Why can't they be more like this guy [or god] over here?)
2. It seems that female insecurity is driven by fear (lack of provision, fear of rejection). Male insecurity, it seems, is driven by definition of who they are.
3. I'm so thankful for this section. I do manage myself so much better these days but let me tell you, my actions have painted a portrait of myself that depicts a woman who thinks she can save everyone from their own destructive selves. It's the curse of being a nurturing person. Thankfully, I have learned w/ God's help how to exercise a firm word or exercise a full step back from a situation that simply doesn't need my involvement.
Rockin' My Freedom
Orange County, CA
30's/Single
Here are my answers for this week:
1. gods. All the men in my life while I was growing up expected unquestioned obedience from me. The women were inferior to them.
2. I think the differences are in how they act out their insecurities.
3. I resonated with both omniscience and omnipotence. I like to know details about things to better understand them. With my girls my anger would flare most often when I felt they were challenging my authority. I,too, bought my husband devotionals and books about dads and daughters, but none of them were ever read, either.
Looking forward to the next chapters!
Joan
Portage,MI
40's
Married
1. I would say I view men as gods because pg. 197 “all my hopes are in men and all my dreams are spun around them” and I have done my husband a disservice by not seeing him as a regular person with weaknesses, self doubts and second guesses. I need to not see him as “mighty, invincible tree, walking.” I have also allowed men to be involved in my “hardest blows and deepest heartbreaks” on pg. 199. I have devoted my most valuable mental attentions to them… In its most basic essence, worship is simple focus. “Countless women keep searching for a do-over in the deferring hope that something will turn out differently this time.” “… I placed a little too much of my personal value and status of wholeness into the hands of a few men: my dad, my husband, …” ALL of that is me to a tee.
2.Men’s insecurities are so much less focused on their physical being or how women see them and so much more focused on their perceived status as a success or a failure in the world. And that perception is so selective and individual based on so many factors. It is actually MORE complicated than so many women's issues.
3. Yes, I struggle with both omnipotence and omniscience issues very much. I should be omnipotent and make everything perfect and right for my husband and my family. And I want to know everything in order to control things in my family’s world to make them work right. This resonated with me A LOT: If we want to become secure women of God we must cease asking questions we can’t handle the answers to. (Page 221)
1.In all honesty, I have, generally speaking, viewed men as devils. I’ve prided myself in not having to rely on a man. I have thought they were “evil” when they showed their vanity by having to work out (go to the gym) every night, be a “manly man” or just exert their power over women. It actually repulses me. It makes me not want to be around men, even my husband because of my “observations” and yet, through this chapter I see that they are as insecure as I am. I have a long way to go but just recognizing they are insecure was enlightening.
2. The fact that men feel like they have to “prove something in order to be men” and secure surprised me. Whereas, women need assurance by someone in order to feel secure. The statement, “One feels frightened by it, but the other feels defined by it” says it all.
3. Controlling or omnipotence. OUCH! I thought I had dealt with the control issue a long time ago, but it reared its’ ugly head again in the form of my insecurities! If only he would (too many filled in the blanks), then I would…
I have to say that just tonight I had an issue with my husband and his former wife. Insecurity reared its ugly head and I failed. I failed miserably. My thoughts were, “If only he would take my side, see it from my perspective, love me more then I would be more secure, more loving to him, and able to deal with the whole step family thing a lot better.” Then I read, “the insecurity that drove the desire in the first place only deepens with each failure.” I cannot control my husband or other people for that matter. I have GOT to look to God for my assurance and my security. Lord, I need your help.
Tammy
Mount Pleasant TX
47, married
1. men are devils
2.men are all about "security for the family" obtaining $, women are about "security of the family" peace, bonding, no stress.
3. Both- omnipotence and omniscience = believing your gods; I don't believe I'm all knowing or all controlling but I know someone who thinks they are.
T
Raleigh, NC
seperated
30's
Men definitely are "gods" to me (thanks for the insight) and most of the time the poor guys never signed on for the responsibilities or frustrations that their inability to meet my changing list of needs must bring!
As far as guys and their insecurities…I think they either hide them really well, or just let it all out for the world to see. There doesn't seem to be much middle of the road there.
Ouch! Omnipotent hit way to close to home. I was a terrible flirt in school and my hubbie and his friends nicknamed me Crash and Burn…for obvious reasons. It was all power and I still have moments when I like to flirt…this was a message I need to hear. Thank you Mama Beth…
Leslie
married
50's
Amy Jo
30s
Married
Wildwood, MO
1) Gods – Most likely stemming from my years of looking for the right one, it seemed like the "good ones" were unattainable and I was unwilling to settle. And, because I think most men put on the secure, confident facade to make everyone think they don't have any insecurities and to not appear weak – but rather "manly".
2) The main difference I see between men's and women's insecurities is that men's seem to be more centered around themselves and how they feel about themselves (fear of failure, providing, being a man), whereas women's insecurities tend to have something to do with how they feel around other people (men, other women, etc) plus all the things about themselves (self-worth, self-image, financial security).
3) Yes, both omnipotence and omniscience resonated with me – I've been trying to decide which one impacts me more – but then decided that they feed off each other, because in order to "control" something you have to "know" about it.
As for omnipotence, I can say that I've made great progress in letting go of some of the control that I was exerting in the first year of marriage (that's common, right?). Deciding which things I need to have an opinion on and take a stand on; and those things that I might have an opinion on (which I usually do!), but don't necessarily need to share that opinion, because it doesn't affect me.
As for omniscience, the part that really stuck with me is being cautious about what you decide you have a "need to know" – and making sure you're prepared to deal with it.
Married
40's
Wichita Falls, TX
1. Looking back at being 19 I looked to my husband to be as a god. I can view some men as devils but not very often.
2. I work with all women so I don't think about differences. I do feel bad when I come in contact with a couple who are married and the wife takes over and tells me what the husband wants and the man never says a word.
3. Omnipotence resonated with me for sure. How I would love for my husband to come to know God as I do. There have been times that I try to force God on him. Matter of fact I talked him into being baptised when our oldest son was baptised. I look back on that and realized it was what I wanted not what he wanted. I sure can feel like an alien around him at times. I can relate to omniscience also. There have been times that I wished I didn't know something that I insisted on knowing. I don't believe I have gone to the extreme that your example did. One of my memory verses last year was. "When I determined to load up on wisdom and examine everything taking place on earth, I realized that if you keep your eyes open day and night without even blinking, you'll still never figure out the meaning of what God is doing on this earth. Search as hard as you like, you're not going to make sense of it. No matter how smart you are, you won't get to the bottom of it." Ecc 8:16-17 The Message.
1. As gods – if a guy would just ask me out then I would feel pretty, desired, worthy. Praise God I now know better and a double praise for all the guys He spared/saved me from — unanswered prayers are blessings.
2. A group of women are likely to sooner or later comment on the need to change some part of their body. I'm just not sure guys are as likely to talk about (with a group of guys) needing to get ripped, tone their thighs or how to lose their poochy stomach.
3. Some of both hit home but what meant the most is 1) Beth's transparency with her man and how much the things she wrote and has tried resonate with me and 2) Knowing and knowing too much. Only God knew how much I needed to read that based on the things I would discover a few hours later. Praise His holy name. And thank you Beth for being real.
Sherri
40s
Single
Georgia
2. Men seem to mask their insecurities a little better than women. It seems men tend to withdraw and keep their insecurities down deep in their hearts while it seems women tend to keep their insecurities closer to the surface.
3. I find myself taken with a little of both (omniscience and omnipotence). I tend to struggle with worrying about what others think of me and whether or not they will accept me. So when I feel that I've said or done something that might cause another person to form an unfavorable impression of me, I tend to worry about what the other person is thinking. Then I will try to control the situation by withdrawing and holding back and not really being myself. I know I'm still a work in progress, but I am "confident of this, that he who began a good work in [me] will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus." (Philippians 1:6)
Emily
Topeka, KS
20's
Single
Lots of food to chew on in chapter11!
1) I think I float around but more often see them as 'devils' I frequently don't give the bennifit of doubt as I should.
Far more shocking and convicting was realizing how when I leave my flesh to run unchecked I could be a 'devil' a snare to see another tripped up. looking back, I can see how in a perverse way to check if I am still attractive, my thoughts have been wrong and maybe at times my actions. Thank God that His Holy Spirit checks me and has kept me from my own foolishness!! Very insightfull.
3) Honestly, both. I want to be in control- not so much my husband as he's even more strong willed than I but I can see it sneek out toward my kids and other relationships and especially situations (like safty). I also want to KNOW so I don't have to worry!!
Reading Ch11 had interesting timing for me which has lead to a few serious questions:
In sunday school we're doing a video series (name I'll withhold sufice to say he is well known) In it he stated thata christian could be controlled/ posessed physically,mentally and soul but not spirit as that was God's. No scripture was given in support of this statement and now I've just read Beth's statement at the bottom of page 204.
Question: Could you please tell me what Scripture passages you base this on?
Any insight would be appreciated!!Everything I've seen in the WORD would agree with Beth but maybe I'm missing something??
My second 'huh!?" Came just tonight before I read Ch11 when at bedtime my daughter who loves to make up songs whipped up a great one about God creating mankind and Eve making a wrong choice eating from the tree …… Out of the mouth of babes God nudges!
Diane
married
30's
can't get the time to read this week – wait for me – I'll catch up!!!!
Chris
Tucson, AZ
By the time I was in high school I had decided that men were devils who THOUGHT they were gods, and it was my duty to embarrass / humiliate them enough to bring them around to truth. There were some exceptions – those who respected me as an equal were also respected as an equal. But the more arrogant the man was, the more determined I was to prove that I was superior. Of course, many of you have already guessed by this time that there was some abuse in my childhood. Another contributing factor in all of this is that I was smarter than most of them. I have a very high IQ and one of my family’s generational sins has been to associate intelligence with superiority. How surprising to learn in this book that men’s arrogance can be caused by a sense of insecurity! And even more surprising to learn that my need to feel superior was also insecurity and pride driven!
God has brought me a long ways down the road since high school. I have repented and been forgiven for placing the gift of intelligence above other gifts our Father bestows to each of us as He pleases for His own good purposes. I have come to realize that an unfortunate down-side of intelligence is the tendency to harbor anger, long-term bitterness and unforgiveness. This stronghold was HUGE and it took a great deal of confession, repentance, and praying Scripture to overcome. I have also suffered many health problems through the years due to repressed anger.
The result of this story is that I am now near 50, single, never married, never had children, and will never have grandchildren. I guess I am hoping that by sharing this, some of you younger Siestas will read it and be smarter than me ….because looking back, I wasn’t so smart after all!
But Praise God – His mercies are new every morning! I am learning to respect men (and women) out of reverence for Christ (1 Peter 2:17, Eph 5:21). I am also learning so much from this book that I am hoping will take me even farther down the road to healing.
Thanks, Beth, for forging the path and then sharing all you learn with us!!
– Brainy Smurf
Thanks for all your encouragement along the way, Siesta Mama! It helps!
1)I don't think I really view men as gods or devils, just people. I've had good and bad experiences with men, as with women.
2) In women, insecurity seems more obvious. It seems like men are better at hiding it. Maybe because they don't have PMS. 🙂
Men also don't seem to take it out on other people the same way women do. They don't seem to wage emotional warfare like women do.
3) Omniscience resonated more with me. I sometimes feel like knowing more might help me, but as you said, it sometimes goes too far and really hurts me.
Elizabeth
Escalon, CA
Single
20's
Stephanie
Macclenny, FL
Married, 30's
1. I definitely view men as gods. I dont know why, but they have always had a power over me and I automatically become lesser than, in any of one of their presence.
2. I think men have different insecurities, even if they word them the same, they are different in what they stand for. When men talk about weight problems, it bothers them, when women talk about weight problems it CONSUMES them.
3. I definitely related to the omniscient, omnipitenent part. All I can say is UGH.
Finally caught up!
1. Definitely see men as gods
2. I feel like their insecurities are more tied up in concrete things like their ability to provide, fix thing, conquer things
3. Omnipotence, definitely-I am a passive aggressive controller- yuck, yuck, yuck! Thankfully by the grace of God I am learning to conquer this tendency but it's so hard since my parents are both passive aggressive communicators and I lived under their roof for 21 years- I love them dearly and we laugh about it, but I'm realizing how hard it is to undue a communication process that is so ingrained. Thankfully, my precious husband is definitely a "say it exactly as it is" kind of guy- so I'm learning what it's like to communicate in a relationship where (at least from his side), it's all laid out there on the table. And, he is very quick to call me on my efforts to control!
Kelli
Lebanon
30's
married
1. Generally speaking I see men as devils. I know in my head that most men are okay, even good. In the depths of my heart I don't trust them. For years I just avoided them all together. I thought I was over what happened and was fine alone. I truly did not think I would ever marry, and then I met my husband and realized how much this affected me. I have a wonderful husband, I can't say that enough, he is the love of my life. I had no clue how deep the hurt went. I still have moments when I react to him in an unfair way.
2. Not that women don't fear failure but it seems to be huge for men. I notice that is what drives men and for women it seems to be how good they look. Not that men don't care about how they look, but women seem to size each other up much more on physical appearance and men on job titles.
3. Omnipotent I try to keep it under control but it sometimes gets the best of me.
Christy
Married
Springfield, MO
20's
I wanted to make one other comment on Chapter 10. Beth, I loved what you said regarding Amanda's insight about Curtis and how those are the kind of men that Satan most desperately wants to bring down. I am personally married to a jewel like that and the Lord has shown me time and again how i cannot let me guard down on my man's behalf! We are "overseas workers" and time and again I've heard comments about how our struggles are different because we do a more Godly work (this is NOT what I think- just what I've heard people say), or how we aren't subject to the same potential sins as "normal" people. Well, let me tell you sisters, we are about as normal as they come (as far as sins people struggle with). I have seen family after family fall because of sexual infidelity or the like, and these are couples who are top of the notch- Satan wants to see our men struggle and fall and he wants to see us struggle and fall and I think a huge part of preventing that from happening aside from the obvious prayer, and spiritual disciplines, is us having a healthy view of our own humanity and potential for sinfulness. I love Amanda's wisdom in recognizing this about her man. Yes, he is a jewel. Yes, my man is a jewel and I"m sure there are many others out there who feel the same way, but the second we start thinking, I would never do THAT, or he could never do THAT- we have given Satan a potential foothold.
Sorry I feel like I"m rambling a litle. For me this relates to my struggles with insecurity in that I have to become secure enough in my relationship with my God who I can't see, to be secure in the imperfections of my man- to recognize him for the human that he is (not a god) and not hold him to too high of a standard.
1. I look at men as god's. I just wanted to be around them all the time. Thought they were so cool.
2. Like another post I read. I too think women dress the part of insecurity. Whether its clothes that are to tight or to big or not even "girlie". Men do tend to dress the same. I think men get more defensive with their insecurities ie. bein arrgoant/know it all. I think women tend to withdraw when faced with their insecurities. (not all, but that is my observance)
3.omnipotence. I do try to control a lot of things in my daily life. A lot with my kids, hubby, and church. This totally goes against my insecurities, but along with my personality. I sometimes take on projects so I can be in charge and have them done "right", but my insecurity is failure. Then I am stressed to the max before and sometimes even after thinking was this done correctly? Did people enjoy it, did it all work out. What could I have controlled so it wouldn't go wrong again next time. BUT I do have some omniscience tendenecies when it comes to certain famimly memembers. Ones who seem not to tell us stuff. I hate it when their friends tell us stuff about our family before we knew. LIke new jobs, or vacations, church positions. Drove me nuts..sooo I consistently emailing or facebook or talking to their friends pumping for info with the reasoning "WE ARE FAMILY…I NEED OT KNOW THESE THINGS"…I have really really tried and backed off from this. The answer is really simple to ALL of this. Prayer. I need to be praying more specifically about these tendencies.
Wow writing it all out and sharing it has made me realize that I need to be more deliberate in my actions. Not passing actions off as its for their own good or because we are family. Thank you!
Erica, KS
married 11 yrs and 3 kids.
Yesterday I listened to a discussion about the vampire series books and movies. My heart goes out to teen age girls who are reading and watching these. Oh how they need to read "So Long Insecurity"! Especially chapters 10 & 11!! But more than that they need to see Christ in my life! I want so much to share with them how He can be everything and more to them!
1) Mostly gods
2) I have seen how men can remain friends even when they have had disagreements. Women have a hard time with this one! I can see where men struggle more with providing for the family than women.
3)I have been taken with omniscience. I always want to know more than I need to. I have never thought about this before! I am so glad this has been pointed out to me and I can now deal with it. I have also been taken with omnipotence but I have been aware of that one for a while! My husband has helped me see it. After reading this I can see where I still need to work on it!
I forgot:
Janice
50's
married
Ohio
1. As I thought about this one, I believe I have viewed each man in my life as both a god and a devil at one point or another.
2. Certainly the difference between my husband's insecurities and mine are from differing planets yet very much the same. Hubby's stem form the unanswered questions of providing and leading the family. Mine surely come from the everywhich way…but I am not longer bound to them. Praise God, I have tools to use when I see them rearing their heads.
3. Omnipotence is definitely an issue with me. My ENTIRE family has and continues to work pleasantly with me on it. I am the butt of many a joke but and learning to pry my skinny little fingers off of God's business and others' as well. Just let me tell you…..
What a great time and day today is!
1). I struggled for a long time seeing men as devils, but in the past few years the Lord has helped me work through that.
2). I'll stick to my own marriage on this one. I can see my husband withdraws with his insecurities and I realized I get all "wordy" hoping he'll come to my rescue by saying just the right thing to boost my ego. Talk about pressure, huh?!
3). In past situations I've struggled with wanting omniscience and getting more and more wrapped up in gaining more knowledge. Once I obtained that knowledge I couldn't help but feel the urgent need to exercise my omnipotence! The Lord, in His grace, showed me how destructive that pattern was to my self-esteem and how destructive it could be to those around me! I am so grateful He opened my eyes. It can still be a struggle, but I learned to put a stop to that desire for knowledge that was not meant for me. It has made a big difference in my life!
I still struggle with not wanting to control my hubby though! It's a continual process, I'm sure.
Marisa
Beavercreek, OH
married
35
1. I think I've tended to view men as gods not devils. When I think back on my dating life I had a tendency to cling to and put on a pedestal the guys I would date even if it was obvious to all those around me that he was not the one for me. I wanted so badly to find the love of my life that I clung to each opportunity that passed by. Thankfully I was able to let go of all of that right before I met my husband and now I do have the love of my life but only one God!
2. It struck me as a difference between men and women's insecurities that men may be less prone to compare themselves to other men than women compare themselves to other women (I said less–I'm sure it still happens). I think men's insecurities are based in a lot of comparing themselves to a standard/expectation they have for themselves that may have nothing to do with society and men around them. While women often base their insecurities in what they fail to notice in themselves compared to other women around them. Did I explain that clearly? It's a little jumbled in my head.
3. Omnipotence vs. omniscience? When I first started this section I really would have said that omnipotence is the one I relate to most. I have always had a control problem-since I was a little girl. I still think that is true, but the most eye-opening one for me was omniscience. While my actions towards this end have rarely reached obsessive proportions, my mind has been there OFTEN! This struggle has spanned almost every relationship I have ever had. I realized that some of the insecurities I've been walking through on this journey were based in my "need for omniscience" and I didn't realize it. That was a freeing realization!
Kristi
Lewisville, TX
married
late 20s
I had to re-read these 2 chapters because things did not pop out as in previous chapters.
1. Devils because my mom dislikes men. Her father left her mother after she was married and had kids. My father left when I was a teenager. Through Breaking Free I was able to gain insight into the "Ancient Ruins". My husband is an amazing Godly man. I do not fear that he will ever leave me. A huge praise!
2. Revelation that men struggle with their physical appearance. My husband does make it a big deal, maybe he is trying to ignore that he feels that way.
3. Omnipotence. Trying to make my husband address areas of unforgiveness. Wanting him to see that without doing that he is blocking his relationship with Christ.
Michelle
Wisconsin
40's
Married
1. A little bit of both. As I have known more and more strong believing men – I have made them gods.
2. Men's insecurities seem to show up as a need to assert themselves as the "top dog" and the one with all the knowledge in the room. With women it seems to be more a need to be wanted, seen and accepted.
3. Omniscience. I was having a difficulty with a friend and I wouldn't rest until I knew EVERYTHING she had said about me. How I wish I had never known! I gleaned some truth from her words – God used it to grow me up in many ways. But it has taken MONTHS for her words to stop haunting me.
Sorry!
Latoya
single
20s
va
1.Growing up I think I longed to see men as gods…I wanted my dad to be worthy of that status, but his erruptive anger kept men looking more like devils. My husband was one of the first men I truly trusted, so in the beginning of our marriage I struggled with where he fit…and definitely had him in the god category for a while. (the story from chapter 1 about Beth focusing all her attention on Keith…yep, I was there too)
3.omniscience- definitely have asked for more than I can handle at times and gone probing where I should have left well enough alone
1. I've viewed men as gods mostly, but I can see periods where I've also seen them as devils!
2. I think insecurity rests evenly on both, but there are differences. It seems that men define themselves by things they do. They are very action oriented. Women are more relational and it's about defining who we are and all the meaning behind it. It seems that men need to do things to feel secure and women need to feel things to be secure.
3. Omnipotent or Omniscient. My husband likes to say that when men and women get married, the woman thinks "I can do something with him!" and the man thinks "I hope she never changes!". It's said in humor but oh how I've made my husband crazy with my "help" that he never asked for (omnipotent). I'd also like to jump on the train of women who really resonated with the Eve analogy. I've been carrying unanswered questions around with me for years. It gives me rest to consider that God may be holding it back because He knows I can't handle it. I believe that. He knows me inside and out and I do believe if I knew the answers, it would probably be just too much to bear.
Marlys
39
Married
Oregon
Rhonda
Ohio
48
married
1. Mostly as gods. Most of my good friends have been guys. Of course, that limited my dating in the teen years since they didn't want to date a great friend/ like-a-sister person in their life.
2. The men I have the most contact with on a day to day basis are looking for affirmation of their being men…the decision makers, making the absolutely right decisions. I've found with some that if I disagree, they get defensive and/or angry. The women on the other hand want to be valued, taken care of, liked or loved no matter what. When that is not happening, they (me too) get discouraged, depressed etc.
3. Yes! Especially the omniscience. I so struggle with wanting to know every detail…especially with my husband and my sons. I've many times gone too far in my snooping to get info so "I'll know how to pray or approach" and every time I'm the one who gets more than I can handle!
Thank You Beth!!! I'm slowly, by the grace of God, getting a grip on it and shoveling it out of my life!!!
1. I knew man had fear's as the bread maker never knew all the other stuff this has been an eye opener my eyes allot more with my husband it has help both of us talk more about or insecurity, We are lot closer with this one area.
2. I do see how men hide this part about them. I know with my husband when it is raising its ugly head and we talk about.
I have understood why God put this studied in my path 1. He wants me to be the Godly women. 2. Is that he wants this wonderful marriage to be an example to all the people who walk in our path.
Thank You Beth and God for this.
Sharon 40 Married
Clinton, NY
Beth,
I have to say your perfectly chosen words describing your incident at the orthopaedic surgeon's office gave me a hilariously funny mental picture that had me laughing hysterically! I'm glad I was home by myself while reading that portion of the chapter. My family would have thought I had lost it! Laughter is good for the soul – thanks for the good laugh!
Now, to the questions:
1) This question stumped me initially and I wasn't quite sure how to answer as I have never really seen myself viewing men as either gods or devils. Without having any negative past with men, I would have to say I probably see them more as gods – as you said "like trees walking" – invicible and powerful. But you have given me food for thought. For my personal value to be wrapped up solely in the hands of my husband is just entirely too much pressure on him! I would never have seen that if you had not pointed it out in the book. I even talked with my husband about that – amazing how much pressure he admitted he was feeling from that.
2)I so agree with your observation – Men withdraw & women cling. Signs to look out for in dealing with my own insecurities.
3)Oh my! I will have to admit that both resonate with me! I have been so guilty of trying to manipulate my husband (and children for that matter) into doing what I think is best for them. Frankly put – it's not my job! I also loved your point about the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Some things are just better left unknown. Thank you for that advice. It has prevented me from opening a can of worms!
I'm loving this reinforcement the second time around. Enjoying it so much – thanks for taking the time to share with us on this blog!
Sweet Blessings ~
Pam
married
30's
NC
1. I have historically viewed them as gods, more like that whole prince charming stuff, – my prince charming will come again on a white horse – with the name Faithful and True!!! – being single, i tend to want to put whom-ever up there, but God is showing me time and time again – there is but ONE rider for that Horse 🙂
2. Since i work in Athletics- and have seen from semi-pro to NCAA to high school… – they have the same ability to tear someone down to make themselves look better, or excuse ignorance. I see a good bit of the beating of chests to say I am better. It's really kinda funny writing that out. (the last part)
3. My real struggle is Omniscience – yes i totally could relate to the story told – i haven't gone quite that far. However, I seem to like to be in the "know" about whatever. This is something that has come on me recently, within the past 2 years.
Page 219 – 2nd paragraph has been my last school year where i am now, has been my awakening alright. But it was desperately one that was needed.
1. I guess I view men as gods. I have pondered the tie my husband has on my insecurities and couldn't quite place the way it was or whether it was insecurities or not. Then I read very few (like 3) comments and everyone of those ladies said they base their moods on their husbands and it all clicked. That is exactly what I do. He had a rough week this week, so naturally I had a terrible week. Is that insecurity? Why do we do that?
2. One day this week, my husband bought a piece of equipment that is going to be used in a venture we are going to pursue. When he got the equipment, it wasn't in as good of shape as he hoped, so naturally he was upset about it. After reading this chapter I reassured him that just becuase he bought a piece of junk doesn't mean he is going to fail. Of course it didn't make him feel any better.
3. Probably omnipotence resonates most with me. If my husband would only…
Joni
30's
Animas, NM
Married
I hope I'm not missing the deadline, but I'm trying to keep up!
I think I lean more towards gods. I've depended upon men as a sorce of security for me and still do especially my dad, who obviously doesn't provide it in the way I need it. I also look towards my man, which is to much for him to bear! Thankfully, I'm working on it!
I found it very interesting on how men and women handle their insecurities and agreed 100% with what you found! My husband does withdraw or make other around him withdraw when dealing with his insecurity of wanting to succeed in all things. The light bulb went on in my head so thank you!
I am totally omnipotent! I must be right, know all things, fix all things ect.
Thank you for this book! I am so excited to lay this insecurity thing in God's garden burn pile. I hope I can pass what I've learned onto my 8 year old daughter so she can "live free" and not bound by insecurity.
Erika
30's
Married
Albany, OR
oops…
ok
Holly
Williamston, SC
30's – Single
Hey Sharon from NY, hang in there girl. This book and doing these blogs have revealed more insecurities in me than I thought were possible. In a sense it's been a relief for me to find the root of so many issues, but sometimes it has been overwhelming as I just simply face them and attempt to turn them over to God. So many tears have been shed at these revelations. Take your feelings of being overwhelmed to God. And don't worry He won't let you drown, but He will continue to heal you. I'm praying for you.
~Lonna
Amy
Single
Washington, D.C.
Single
1. My tendency has been to view men as gods. The one thing I had a hard time identifying throughout these chapters was while others have had male experience (in marriage, dating, and relationships) I have had none. My experience is ZERO. So I had to think about my thought life and how I've seen men that I have liked (obviously without them knowing)and allowed my perception of them become more than what it should be. I'm a daydreamer by nature so that has also proven to be a stronghold throughout my teens and into my twenties because I go too far. Not having experienced a relationship I have wondered what it would be like; so when I think of having a male companionship by my side I experience it perfect…he's perfect. Make sense? Most men, generally speaking, I see as intimidating creatures who judge me right away, therefore I have no standing to even call myself a "friend" sometimes. (not all men, of course…just those either established in careers, handsome, or…well, secure.)
2. I know this sounds funny, but I've seen men lately talk to much and that has shown me how secure they are! when they are caught or when they are not sure (especially when they aren't sure) they ramble. Another is make excuses. With the women…I see it so much; they have to have someone by their side. They have to flirt with every member of the male species. The men are insecure do the same. A few months ago I saw someone I work with have 4-5 girls on either side of him with his arms around them! Talk about insecure. He had to have female attention to feel like he was special…secure.
3. Omniscience. I've really only seen omnipotence with my family. Let me explain; I love my family and want the best for them and we all know God is about to move them forward in their lives. The past few conversations (before I read the chapter) I have got to the point where it seems like I have done nothing but told them what to do, how to do it, and when to do it. Finally, my mother started crying one day and explained that while she wanted to do all the things I suggested she also knows God wants things in his timing and I need to be a little understanding. After I apologized I realized the biggest thing I can do to help is pray for God's guidance for them. So, omniscience is definitely where I identified myself. I feel like I have to know everything. I want to know everything and it's so hard to let God take control of that and trust Him. Not knowing my future is exactly where I'm at right now and it kills me not to know. I'm so future minded that I don't live in the present. This hurts me and my relationship with Christ. I tell God I'm giving Him my all but by holding this part of me back I'm only hindering His blessings. I need to learn that I can't and should not know what my entire future is but allow God to show me, step-by-step, what my next move is…and trust that my ultimate future and occupation (specifically) is going to work out and be woven together with His will.
1. I think I tend to see some guys as gods and others as devils. Sometimes a sweet guy that I meet I will look at as a god, but really frequently, because of the sterotypical reputation of some mens dishonoring attitude towards women, I view them as devils. Jesus help me to see men clearly, how you see them.
2. Chapter 10 on men's insecurities really got me thinking…so I asked my 13 year old brother and his friend while I was driving them somewhere if they agreed and felt like they (or men for that matter) had insecurities. They totally agreed! Anyways, I see similarities in that both men and women want their appearances to be the best of the best for their gender. I also see differences in that women tend to want to find security in men, and men feel pressure to not fail as the provider and spiritual leader of their homes.
Jesus is good!
Love you Beth 🙂
Chesney
16
Single
Knoxville
1. Historically, as Gods, as a teenager and young adult I thought men held the key to what would make me feel complete and happy. It wasn’t until I met Jesus that I discovered that a man would never meet or fill those deep voids inside me.
2. Women do things that appear desperate and controlling when they feel insecure and men withdraw.
3. Omnipotence-especially with my little (cow)boys. We live on a ranch with miles and miles to explore. My boys are adventurers and magnets to everything that is dirty, rough and dangerous. They are true country boys. Having grown up in town, I struggle with knowing when to tighten those reigns and when to let the reigns loosen. I don’t want to stifle their creativity and free spirits by excessive rules and hovering. It seems like such a delicate balancing act, but, in the end it comes down to me choosing to step outside of my comfort zone and consciously remind myself that God is in control.
Kim
40's, Married
South Dakota
1. I would have to say as gods.
2. I think men tend to pretend more effectively that it is not there. Or maybe it is just that being a women I see it more easily in the female than in the male. They don't seem to get as emotional. What I mean is that the don't usually cry or put them self down out loud to others. Unless it is someone close to them of course. But women seem to tell just about anyone in some way or another. It may be subtle but it is there. You stuff like apologizing when there is no need to and for something they were no responsible for, or making excuses for they way they look or how they do things. I am sure you get my point. Most men just do the thing with out making excuses and just are who they are. I know that there are exception, but I think in public those are rare.
Wow what a question. I would have to say both of them. I tend to think that I know what the other person is thinking about a given situation and in reality I have no earthly idea. I also tend to think they are thinking the worst about me or something I did and then I apologize. When in reality they did not even give me or whatever I said or did a second thought. I also worry so much thinking that my actions will affect what ever I am trying to control. I also want everyone to get along and not think anything bad about me or my family. So I work to make sure that does not happen. Yes it is impossible. Oh
I am pressed for time and not writing very clearly. Ugh. Sorry about that. I am trying to get out the door to go to Tucson to hear a certain person speak this weekend. Would you happen to know who she is. Ok Got to go.
Kim
Thatcher, AZ
married
50
Julie
32
Married
Washington State
1. I tend to view men as gods.
2. Men's insecurities don't seem so obvious and they really don't want to admit it or talk about it. To appear weak in any way. Where women sometimes tend to wear theirs as a badge of honor.
3. Omniscience~ I lean towards wanting to control the ones I love (my husband & 3 kids) to supposedly make their lives better and happier. This section was an eye opener, thank you Beth for being so open and honest about you own struggle with this.
Monica
OHIO
40
I am the devil to my man, trying to control and break him down. I KNOW that I do it. I have to beg forgiveness for it so often. Before I even know it, sometimes, I start. I could relate perfectly with your description of how you were with Keith; but mine is just in general life. It's my own selfishness, I know it. One of the best things is that in the past 6 months I have been able to call myself out on it. Thank you GOD for my awesome man, who keeps forgiving me.
I asked my husband about his insecurities as they come out of his brokenness as well. Where mine tend to be focussed towards him and my "security" issue; his are actually as Curtis put it, fear of failure. Dead on. And Andy's insecurities tend toward his "boss" and his career more than with "me." But all in all we have the same issue, just show it out differently.
I have been answering the questions to the SLI discussion group by writing a post on my blog.
http://theleakingwindow.blogspot.com/
I have copied most of my post here… just wish I could show you the amazing photo that my husband took of me trying to walk on eggshells…
Eggshells.
I would think by this time…
I would not resort to walking on eggshells…
but I do.
Sometimes it just seems safer
to walk on eggshells
than to find out what the real problem is.
Did I say "safer"?
Perhaps I meant "easier"?
And that is ONLY for the short term.
Because in the long term…
the longer I walk on eggshells…
the more eggshells I have to clean up.
And really they are quite a mess.
Sticky. Smelly.
And especially disgusting when wearing sandals.
1.Growing up I generally viewed men as "devils"… not trusting them. I was abused by my father. He divorced my mom… and I grew up in a household of women. I always tried to have the upper hand in my dating relationships… if I lost that control… well, it was time to move on… that is… until I met him. I've always viewed my relationship with Anthony to be a gift from God. Not that it is all smooth sailing, but God definitely chose Anthony for me… because I did not have enough good sense at that time to do it on my own.
I am aware of how I tie my security to Anthony (my husband). If he is not happy… had a bad day… I can resort to walking on eggshells. Wondering if I can fix the problem… or am I the problem?
2.Chapter 10 reminded me of the book Love & Respect by Dr. Emerson Eggerichs. How husbands and wives get on "The Crazy Cycle"
… she reacts without respect he reacts without love she reacts without respect…
and so on. How men crave respect (ie fear of failure) and women crave love (ie fear of rejection). I highly recommend this book.
3.Extrasensory perception – Honestly. Christopher asks me quite often which super hero power I would choose if I could choose any one I wanted. ESP. That way I would know if I am upsetting someone or if I have hurt someone or what exactly they want from me. Omniscience.. hadn't thought of it that way… and I much rather like that terminology, but I'll save that for God. I've got enough to deal with in my own head.
Sheri
Portland, Oregon
40's
Married
First of all, I have to thank the Lord for spring break and a chance to get caught on a lot of things, including SLI!
1. I would have to say that my tendency is to view men as devils…although I have often thought that they think of themselves as "gods." Sex has seemed to dominate their problems and decisions to such an extent that I have thought it must be a real burden to be male!
2. Chapter 10 helped me to see, perhaps what I knew, but need a refresher…men just demonstrate their insecurities in different ways. It is prideful of me to think I am "right." I need more than a dab of understanding and compassion!
3. No surprise here. I tend toward omnipotence (control). The first sentence of Chapter 11 was such a huge encouragement…sustainable victory in this flesh-and-blood exitence IS possible! Oh how I want this victory. Rom. 12:1-2.
I struggle to trust my husband (and the Lord?)if he is not doing things my way. He has the power to threaten my security or strengthen it. I try to control him by silence…someitmes unconsciously because of hurt and at other times intentionally when I am mad. This has been especially true in the areas of finances and spiritual life. He is a bigger spender than I am…his means of controling me, and I want him to be more "spiritual" by having devotions and prayer…not bad things unless it is because of my pressure and not a heart devotion to the Lord. I need to give him more freedom to be who he is with the many strengths that he has.
Pam
married
50's
1.I tend to lean towards viewing men as gods until they prove to me they are devils. Chapter 10 really opened my eyes to the fact that I have never had to prove that I am a woman, but men feel they need to prove they are a man, wow. I read some of the survey replies to my husband and he agreed with the fear of failing and he definitely withdraws when he is feeling insecure.
2. When I am feeling insecure or have a problem, I talk a blue streak until I either solve it or feel better about the situation. My husband is just the opposite, he gets real quiet until he makes peace with the problem. It is hard for me to let him do this because I am always sure if he would just talk about it he would feel better. Alas, he doesn't work that way and I have learned to respect his need to withdraw.
3.Niether one resonates with me, but if I had to choose I think I would lean more towards omnipotent. However, I have never had a burning desire to control anyone. My role as a wife is to respect my husband and if I disagree with him, I share my concerns, then WE make a decision together. As a parent I believe my role is to guide them, teach them about life, discipline when needed and ultimately prepare them for the world and teach them how to be happy, functioning adults. Also to lead them to a good strong relationship with God and to find strength, guidance, wisdom, refuge and so much more with Him and His word. That is where they will find life and find it abundantly. Really I wan't to be a good role model for our children, NOT a control freak.
Andrea – Montana – 40's – married
This is my goal: to let the healthy, utterly whole, and completely secure part of me increasingly overtake my earthen vessel until it drives my every emotion, reaction and relationship.
Sorry I'm a week behind but I'm still catching up from spring break. I think I'm back on track now.
1) I tend to do both. I have such horrible trust and rejection issues that I tend to treat men like devils so they can't hurt me and then treat them like a god (my husband) so he can "fix" me. Placing all my sense of security in how much he loves me, adores me, worships me. ouch. I can't remember which study it was, maybe Esther, but Beth told us how Keith told you;" Don't put your trust in me, I'll let you down". That statement really opened my eyes and helped to change my marriage. It helped me see I needed to look to Jesus for my trust not to put that burden on my husband.
2) After reading Chapt.10, I think both genders suffer from many of the same insecurities. How they look compared to other men, how their jobs, wives, cars, kids, income. I think it's all the same. I didn't really think about men being insecure before.
3) I am so both or was, I'm getting much better. "an insecure person's greatest need for control is directed toward those who have the most potential to either threaten her security or strengthen it." The first years of my marriage I was a total control freak! I tried so hard to "fix" my husband. I just recently remodeled our bathroom and finally threw away the unopened multiple bottles of vitamins, hair gels and facial products that he "needed". He also has many unopened church sermons of Sunday's he missed. Praise God I sought counseling and sought His grace and I am happily, most days, on the other side of this control issue.
And as for omniscience, I was merciless on my poor husband when we first got married. I wanted to know EVERYTHING. I mistakenly thought this would bring us closer, make us one. So wrong. Bad memories. You can know too much.
I also have learned that with friends, schools and churches, you can know too much. Information that borderlines on gossip, "you don't get the same kind of grace that accompanies divine revelation." I used to have to know every detail so I could properly be "informed". Thank you Lord I've learned that just isn't so.
opps!
Sharon
San Antonio
married
40's