Hey Everybody! I am so proud of you guys! Your discussions have been tremendous. I am especially happy that so many of you have jumped in with us late and gone back to the very beginning, signed in, and added your answers to the previous weeks of our book discussion. Way to go! As we moderate, we give the same attention to the comments on the older posts as the ones that are up-to-date. I promise you that community and active discussion will make your journey far more meaningful and hold you infinitely more accountable.
Ok, we’re about to get to a part of the book that I found highly interesting in research. The next several chapters involve the insights from the men’s survey and I bet a few of their comments will pop your eyes open, too. In the mix of what we have ahead, we’re going to be focusing on men-related insecurities then soon after that (in coming chapters) we’ll focus specifically on women-related insecurities. Each of us has a tendency to be less secure around one gender than the other and, according to the survey of over 900 of you, we’re almost evenly divided between the two. I pray we’re going to gain insight into some gender-related insecurities and stumble upon some much needed freedom. I really want you to read the portions about the men even if you don’t have a mate or a specific man in your life. If we have resistant, resentful hearts toward men, we can’t just avoid them altogether. They comprise the other half of our population so it really is imperative in our pursuit of wholeness that we get a grip.
Your assignment for this week is to read CHAPTERS 10 AND 11 and answer the following question:
1. Based on Chapter 10, in all truthfulness, has your historical tendency been to view men (generally speaking) as gods? Or devils?
2. Based on Chapter 10 and your own day-to-day observances, what differences do you see between men’s insecurities and women’s?
3. On p.208 in Chapter 11, I suggest that women who struggle with insecurity tend to be particularly taken with 2 divine attributes: omnipotence and omniscience. Did either of these resonate with you? If so, how?
We are liable to have some LIVELY conversation this week! I can’t wait to see it happen! Just one little thing I want to throw out there: some of you may have some pretty big hang-ups with men because you have a background of abuse like I do. If it plays heavily into one of your answers, by all means, share what pertains but I’ve learned along the way that it’s best to stop short of graphic descriptions. Most people have a hard time knowing what to do with those kinds of mental images. I’ve told every graphic detail in counseling situations but, publically, I try to stay general. It’s just too much for most listeners and readers. They have compassion but they just don’t have the answers. We know Who does.
Go for it, Girls! I’m so honored to take this journey with you.
Joyce 
Wonderful book, Beth.
First, I probably think of men as
gods. My dad was one I looked up to and got my valadation from. Most of insecurity and self-worth was crushed by the things my mom said to me…like you are going to be the first to wreck the car, she has a hard time in school etc.
As far as the difference in men and women:
My dad and my husband both clam up and inward depending on the situation. Sometimes I have to get my husband to open up and talk by just discussing things as adults. I think discipline with children is a hard thing for some men. They rather the women disciple the kids.
Women seem to talk about everything sometimes they say too much. I'm afraid I clam up sometimes too, because I was taught to be quiet…I wrote one-hundred times in school "I will not talk" so much- I finally shut-up and was afraid to say anything.
Not to mention my sister out-talked me all the time. My opinion meant little.
When I first got married I thought where is he, why is he so late etc. but he was in the army__I finally learn to relax and trust God. He is a wonderful, Christian man. Then, when I had children I had to learn to trust God to take care of them when they went to school, while they are gone to camp, when they go to college etc. (still learning this) My own mother was too controlling and left me fighting not to be too cling-y. I wish my own mother could have trusted God more, because it has been a hard-road for me to keep fighting against being controlling and making my own children feel secure.
My mother's dad was the abuser in the family. Many family member will not discuss this, but He unappropriately touched me at an
young age. I could not trust him.
My mother never talked about what he did if anything to her. She died of cancer in 1977. I loved her and know she was a Christian, but there is still questions in the back of my mind. Some of my insecurity, rejection etc. is from not being open and honest.
God is showing me a better way.
I am seeking Him. Please pray for me and my family.
Just yesterday I had to face some insecure feelings and it was hard.
My sister has not talked to me in a long time, so I called her. She cut me off short and made me feel she does not care to hear from me at all. It really hurts, because I tried to show I love her and not be too bothersome. I had reassure myself__You may reject me, but my God does not reject me. My God will encourage me. My God will help me through. My God is my Strength!!
Oh, sorry for writing so much_Beth My heart is just overwhelmed and it is flowing out of me. Maybe, someone will be helped. God bless you, Sweet Sister in Christ
I used to think of men as gods … but the more that I'm around different me, the more I think of them as devils. Especially my husband. Isn't that terrible?
Carol
Albuquerque NM
53YRS
Single
1. I view men as devils due to child abuse by more than one person I have a hard time trusting men First of all Dad was one of them and cousins so needless to say I really have a hard time respecting any man.
2. I believe men hide under there insecurities in pride and they withdraw. Women isecuruties speaking for myself I think I have conflict with other women because I want to feel important and I want to be able to have people to notice me but I feel like people don't notice me so I believe men handle insecurities different than women
3.Chapter 3 Eating from the wrong tree
Trying to control the situation I felt like I needed to control due to some situations. I believe I need to know about the knowledge of good and evil then when I do find out I wish I would never have known. Because it will hurt one of the situations is with my mom her health is failing and has been sick for about 3yrs but I know some stuff about her health that my sister does not know and I only know because of a paper found in her car after a Dr appt and should have never read it. But the Lord has given me peace and grace to handle her health problems I think but at times I am scared about the whole situation. But thats what I mean I do not need to know everything about her health God know's and I think it is better that we don't know all the details.But sometimes it burdens me to see her my mom that is and not knowing alot of things about her and my family is real good about hiding things from each other and the lies can't begin to tell you about that. I praise God that He knows me and Loves me and I am clothed with strength and dignity
Thank you sweet seista mama for all you do for us.
Carol
To Siesta Rebecca Hang in there sweet one will be praying for you God Loves you and He will hold you in the palm of His hand.
Joyce Watson_
Inside my heart
is still a little girl
Who likes to hope, to dream
and enjoy life everyday
Who needs for others to encourage her and sometimes even pray.
Inside my heart
is still a little girl
Who cries, who hurts
and sometimes feels life's pain
Who seeks God's mending love
more than anyone or anything.
Inside my heart
is still a little girl
Who has grown in God's care
And whose spirit feels at peace
Knowing God's love is always there.
Inside my heart
is still a little girl
Who laughs and like to play
And share the good times and bad
And wants to share God's love to others each day.~joyce
1. I think I've thought of men as gods. I see them as authority figures on whom I depend for approval. That's an interesting thought, and I will gnaw on that for awhile.
2. I agree with you that basically women know in their core from babyhood they are female. In the book it came across to me that men have to achieve "manhood" by recognition of other males that they respect. All siestas have a diva gene in their DNA, but apparently being a man is a title conferred by achievement. Bless their hearts, they are as big a mess as we are, but there are a whole lot of them who can't verbalize that.
3. Ooooh, oooh, oooh, omnipotence–I want to be in control. I spent 30 years as a teacher. I had to be in control. I am kind of over that now in most respects because I found out fairly early people can't be controlled from my own children. It felt like I had given birth to aliens because they didn't see things my way or do what I wanted to them to do. How can you carry these creatures around for 9 months, go through labor and childbirth, and then they have the nerve not to see things your way.
And Casey, I am doing Esther right now, too. It works together really well. I just finished Beth's book on David today, too. Again, it has played into this book so well. I think I will wait to do the next study, tho. Getting your nerd on with Bible study. LOL!! What a great way to say it.
My husband is so awesome. He is so encouraging through all this, and I loved learning something that will help me be more of a help to him.
Lahna
60's, married,
TX
Brittney
Pflugerville, TX
20s
Married
1. I think (actually I KNOW!) I view men as gods… especially my husband. When I'm down, I feel like I look to him too much to "pick" me up. Like he holds the key to my happiness! I've done this in a lot of relationships. Like you said Beth, I need to look UP instead of OUT 🙂
2. I don't know, it's close. Both have insecurities about looks. But, it seems to me that women's insecurities seem to be about themselves and on the inside, while men seem to have outside insecurities. Does that make ANY sense at all? haha! Like, men feel they need to DO for their family, where as a woman may feel they need to BE for their family.
3. Most definitely omnipotence. I am one for CONTROL. I feel like if I don't do it, it won't get done. Or even better… if it's not going my way, I have to find a way to make that happen.
**
I have to say Beth. I've had a HARD couple of weeks. I am completely loving this journey and I'm trying to soak every moment of it up. But I have to share a story with you Beth. You see… one of my good friends is marrying my ex. Now, this isn't a big deal. Sort of. But it is to her. This past May, my husband and I got married, this friend was a bridesmaid and a few months before the wedding revealed to me that she was dating the ex. I was really happy for her but at the same time weird-ed out… am I wrong in this? To feel weird? She asked if he could come to the wedding as her guest. I have not seen him since the break up (but it was a big one) and well, I told her that it would be awkward to see him for the first time since the "break up". Especially for the first tim at my wedding. Ya know? Well, anyways… this friend just got engaged to the said ex and I sent her a congratulations that went something like this "hey __ I'm so excited for you and __! congratulations on the engagement! have a great week!" Miss Beth, my friend and I got coffee this week and she said she was "confused" by me. I explained my feelings through and through… she said she doesn't know why he couldn't come to the wedding if I was happy for them. It kind of upsets me… but maybe I went a little overboard and being ok with it. I think I made a fool of myself?!
Oh my goodness, these chapters have been sooo eye opening, and mind blowing – How did you see me?
Thank you Beth, I really did have some digging to do, and some good thinking to do, and some confessing to do!
1) men have been both gods and devils. My dad was so over aggresive that I walked as small as I could. I also was raped at the age of 18. I both feared men and felt under their thumb.They held all the power.
Thankfully God has been working with me through the years to a more healthy view of them and myself. He did not leave me in my prision, I have been walking free and becoming the woman I love.
2) Men can use anger to control both themselves and others. Insecurities isn't something they admit to, even to themselves.
3)I have fallen completely under the omnipotence and you which you have said about your husband, I have tried with mine. Thankfully he hasn't gone along with it.
I was most impressed with the message of omniscience. I totally wanted all the dirt, from my husband's previous relationships with the women he had dated. I too got some dirt that I now wish I never asked for. I am taking this dirt to Him and asking for His healing in the images I placed on the information gain. I did not know that this error had a name and I am so thankful to get a handle on something I just didn't know what to do with.
Did I mention I am thankful!
Beth you have done me a great favour letting me know how to live a better, holier life, and I thank God He works in you, to bring to me.
Diana
married
44
BC Canada
Oops, I realized a mistake in the first comment I posted. Francesca Batistelli sings "Free to be Me" not Brit Nicole(you all probably knew that already, but it was bugging me). Sorry.
3. The part about omniscience resignated with me. There are several situations that I've been dealing with and God has told me "part of the story". I keep wanting to know more, but I've come to realize that God is protecting me. (He knows what I can handle and how much I can handle at one time.) I've never thought about the "knowledge of good and evil" being an example of omniscience. I am now praying to have divine revelation instead of "the whole story".
Patti, Kissimmee, FL 40's married
I just started my reading tonight, and I just could not help but tell you that I am pained to my very core about your experience at the orthopedic. However, I am also pained to my core from laughing about it! I just couldn't go to bed without sympathizing with you. Thank you for sharing your crazy moments with us! Oh, and I got a great book in the mail today for my birthday. I just haven't decided how I'm going to tell my cousin that I'm already on Chapter 10 of it! Only someone who really loves you can give you a book called "So Long Insecurity" for your birthday!
Tamara
Kelowna, BC, Canada
late 20s
single
1)I tend to see men more as gods. I've had too many female friendships that ended with me feeling rejected and so I've always turned to men to be my friends because I don't trust other women easily.
2) I've noticed (from personal experience) that men often seem to be insecure about their ability to provide financially for a woman – especially when she's already finished a degree and started a career. Whereas, myself and some of my friends are more insecure about how our education/careers have put up a wall between us and other men – we sometimes are insecure about our education and the career it has allowed us to have. (A career that all of us would put second to a family of our own if we had one.)
I've also noticed that when insecure about something in a friendship men tend to withdraw more, while women tend to try to cover it up with lots of talking and busyness and many people.
3) Omniscience definitely resonated with me. I feel like something is being hidden from me on purpose when I see two people I know having a conversation about something. I want to know what they're talking about and I will try to figure it out. To justify getting that information I will tell myself that I need to know if it was something bad about me.
Dear Anonymous Rebecca- March 18, 2010 12:08 PM
Rebuke the enemy, in the name of Jesus! God loves you, & has a special purpose for you!
Keep repeating a verse that resonates (maybe 1 from the March 6, 2010 post). Keep replacing it with the thought that 'there isn't anything worth getting out of bed for'.
In one of Beth's books (maybe "Get out of that Pit") she mentions how she put the Bible – open to the verse that applied – over her head – slept with it that way, to use God's power to overcome the stronghold she was dealing with. (Someone correct me if I am wrong)
Praying that you will KNOW Him, His healing power over your past & HIS reason that you should get out of bed. 🙂
http://www.biblegateway.com is a great way to search for words, topics or scripture references.
With love, Barb, 50s, Married
(I will post my comments later)
Asking for prayers! The fill in the blank prayer chapter halted me. I feel as if I will sink before I win this battle. Praying I can overcome and maybe God will bless me with a friend to talk this stuff out with in the meantime.
Blessings, ladies!
Ok, girls… I'm officially on Spring Break and can actually take the time to read the comments and make comments about SLI. (I've added 7 new violin students in the past month, and it is eating my time up big time!) Anyhow, I hope you'll forgive my absence from the previous conversations, and for coming along late. I will try to catch up. I've been reading all of the chapters, just haven't had time to read your comments or to answer discussion questions. Thanks!
I'm admittedly behind but this has been such a blessing to me. I feel led to share a part of my journey over the past few weeks and ask you sweet sisters for prayer. I'll try to make it short. In a nutshell, my husband had cancer 10 years ago (when I was pregnant with our 2nd daughter). Praise the Lord he is fully healed but because of the nature of his cancer we are reproductively challenged 🙂 and this has become a huge journey for us. Naomi (daughter number 3) was born 4 years ago by in-vitro and God has led us to follow this path again. I'm sharing this with you all because I've realized what a big part it has played in some of my own insecurities and the timing of this book has been simply amazing.
Basically, I had the first of two in-vitro procedures on Wednesday to retrieve the egg. This was the first little miracle in that there was only one egg and she was able to get it. We've spent the last 48 agonizing hours waiting to hear if it fertilized or not- I was supposed to go back this morning to have it put back in. I just got off the phone with my doctor and basically it did fertilized but the little embryo is dividing slowly so she wants to wait until tomorrow to put it back in.
(in her words, “I don’t’ want to transfer a dead embryo”). I am supposed to go in at 8 tomorrow morning (Saturday)for the embryo to be transferred. (we are in Beirut Lebanon so 8 hours ahead of central time) Unfortunately, I broke one of my cardinal rules which is that I typically don’t look at the internet about medical things as I know me too well. I know this whole process is not about medical chances but about our Creator and His perfect will and timing. Unfortunately, I also now know that a “slowly dividing embryo” is not such a good thing when it comes to IVF. I would be lying to you if I told you that I am ok- I am an emotional wreck. Thankfully I am an emotional wreck loved by God and He is holding me together. This whole fertility journey over the last 6 years or so has been one of the most challenging, most frustrating, most joyful things I have ever experienced, but in no other time or experience of my life have I ever felt God’s comfort and love or heard His very specific voice more clearly. There have been times when my heart has just cried out to please just take away this desire for more kids, I am already so beyond blessed with my three beautiful girls, however there is no doubt in my mind that this desire is from God and that we are following His very specific plan. Please pray for this sweet little one that is taking it’s time to divide. Pray God’s special control and blessing over his or her development. Pray that my stomach will calm down so I can eat today. Pray for anything else you think of and feel free to ask others to pray. I love you all. Thanks for letting me be transparent (not that you had a choice…)
Oh- sorry, I forgot
Kelli
married
30's
I have always tended to look at the men in my life as gods. I expected them to fulfill me, encourage me, and be perfect in every area of their lives. I didn't expect this of every man on the planet, but I DID expect it of those to whom I was emotionally invested. I wanted to believe that these men who held my trust were worthy of it. I was afraid that if they failed in one area, somehow they would fail in every area and I would be left alone. I preferred the illusion of perfection (idolatry) to the confrontation of reality (that the men in my life are just as messed up as I am).
For many men I think their insecurities are tied to their "performance" (whether that be at work, at home, etc.) I know for my husband, some of the darkest times of his life were when he felt like other people saw him as a failure. We spent many evenings talking about it. I couldn't understand why he was so concerned about what other people thought of him (After all, I loved him, what more could he want?) I expected him to be satisfied by what I was looking for – affirmation from those closest to me.
As a woman, I feel like my insecurities are tied to my own intrinsic "worth/value" as perceived by those closest to me. Honestly, what the woman across the street thinks of me is not near as important as what my husband thinks.
Beth, I’m pretty sure God put the words of chapter 11 in there just for my stubborn ears to hear. I’m so thankful that you were obedient to His leading, because I so desperately needed to hear this. I never realized I was trying to be God, and I so totally was. A few years ago I was convinced that my husband was keeping something from me and so I snooped until I found what I was looking for. It just about destroyed me. Do you want to know how stupid I am? I kept it. It even has its own folder in my e-mail inbox. I labeled it “Pain.” I have held onto that stupid letter for two years now. I have kept it just in case I needed to be reminded of the hurtful things that were said (as if those words weren’t seared onto my heart). I so regret eating from the tree of the “knowledge of good and evil.” I knew I wasn’t supposed to do it, but I wanted my fears and insecurities to be validated. It has done me no good. Part of me did “die” when I read it and my heart still aches if I allow myself to dwell on it. I am not my husband’s Holy Spirit. It’s not my place to convict or condemn. God is more than capable of doing that without my help, and heaven knows He does a much better job. During my whole “ordeal” God continually asked me “Do you trust me?” I am learning that I need to trust my husband to Him as well.
Sarah
married
20s
Kind of at a stand still…I guess I had to have another go-around of expressing insecurity and making a toltal fool of myself in order to "get it". Seeing that up close look at it and recognizing it for what it is (insecurity I'm praying will bring healing and security for good.
Thanks for the ministry you have to me and other women.
You were completely in the right for not wanting your ex at your wedding and your friend was completely in the wrong for asking. She was being totally selfish and was focusing on her own insecurity and wanted to sacrifice you on your special day to get what she wanted. There is no greater pressure in your 20's then making the wedding rounds of all your friends and not being able to show everyone your "special" guy. Your friend just didn't want to go to your wedding alone and have everyone think she couldn't get a date.
I am divorced and my ex and I got along very well but when he showed up with his future wife for the first time at my son's Christmas program, I thought I was going to faint. I promise you, if you had allowed him to come, it would have ruined your day and all of your wedding memories would have been tied to him.
Your friend is confused because she didn't get what she wanted. I am glad you said you were happy for them but there is a difference between being happy for them and wanting to bring him back into your life. You don't owe her any further explanation. One day you may decide it won't matter to be around them both but you are entitled to do that on your own terms and in your own time. End of story.
It is your friend who has made a fool of herself, not you. Hold your head high and enjoy your new man!
Leanne
20's
Married
Mississippi
1)I tend to view men as gods. I was raised by my dad and he was/is my hero. Then I am married to my best friend and hero. Of course I do know a few men that seem like devils but overall I have always viewed men as gods. They are the protectors and heads of households.
2)I think in everyday life men and women both deal with insecurities about their outside appearances and finances. I think men deal more with insecurities over power and women deal more with insecurities with other women and comparing each other.
3)I can see how I try to change my husband by nagging but in my mind I think I am encouraging him. Also I have tried to see what only God can see about things. That spoke to me SO much. I now realize how knowing details of the past will only hurt my marriage and not help it. I don't need to know what only God knows.
Beth and all~
1. I had a great daddy, a godly man who was real. He made mistakes but he turned his focus on God in those times. So I guess, most men in my life were godly men and I tend to view them more in the "godly" sense. I know I did with my husband also. So maybe I see how I am more critical on him during those weak times.
2. This was interesting to see how insecure men really are. I am most profoundly affected in the role I can play in this with my own husband. I too think I can "help" him by buying books and Cd's like you did Beth. My words and my affection speaks louder than those things.
3. What hit me most with this section is my need to control, especially my girls. This was very eye opening. I have had to come to terms with this unspoken control issue I was awaken to. My goal is to turn my girls, my frustrations in marriage, over to God's control. Where it should be. Seriously, how much happier will I be if I am not in control? Grief, I have some work ahead of me.
Leaving today to take our youth on a spring break retreat (to Arkansas no doubt!!). I wish I had more time to post. Pray God will show himself in a mighty way-some of the kids don't know Him. thanks!!
Believing Him~Pamela
Missouri
46, married, blended family
Tori
Married, 20s
GA
First, I would just like to say that I don't watch much TV (well, since I have had my now-6-month-old)but I love TLC's What Not to Wear. Those women- I feel I have a connection to now (having survived, overcome my insecurities (though still working on)…every time I watch I see and feel them hurting and I just come to tears and want to fly to where they are, give them a huge hug and a copy of this book! It has helped me so much, God has collected my broken pieces up out of the mud, washed them off and put them back together and I want so badly for every woman to have what I have…to see Him as I see Him and I can never thank you Mama Beth for opening my eyes to Him as you have done and now allowing Him to work through me!
1. My view has been mostly that men are gods… which is hard to believe since I was basically raised hearing the opposite. Not that seeing them as gods is necessarily a wonderful thing but…nonetheless…
2. I never really thought that men had insecurities until I read "For Women Only" By Shaunti Feldhahn… it was a great eye-opener to some of the insecurities men have and how what we say and do can have an impact on them and why they do some of the things they do. But, I still had no idea that my insecurities weighed so much on my husband until I read the comments made by the men in the study! And, the SAD, embarrassing part, is that for the most part, their comments were true! I see on a daily basis that most of my insecurities (well the OLD part of me!) were brought up by others… other women who were "prettier" "better" etc. The biggest light-bulb moment I had was when you said that our math is messed up! Just because she is pretty does NOT mean that I am not pretty or any less pretty! Just because she got a raise or a promotion, does not mean that I am any less deserving, it is just how God worked things out right now and it is all in His timing! It took a lot of praying and God working in me for me to (a) realize that (b) accept that (c)believe that! I explained this to my husband and he was blown away! He was like "WOW, I love Beth Moore for showing/ teaching you that! I wish every every woman would realize that or that their man could tell them that without getting in trouble!" I said, "Yes, she and God are amazing!" I see my husband's insecurities more related to not being able to provide for our family as he sees fit or more self-inflicted insecurities instead of comparisons like mine (does that make sense)?
3. All I really have to say about omnipotence and omniscience is the whole part where you describe you and Keith and getting him the vitamins (untouched), CDs (still in the wrapper), shoving him to his happy place, cherry limeaids (which my hubs and I cherish!) just made me laugh hysterically out loud, mark the page with a million exclamation points and get my husband to read it… it is exactly us!!! It is like you wrote a biography of my husband and I!
I cannot exactly remember where in the book that was, I have finished my journey and passed the book along to a friend but there was something about tying our emotions to our husbands and their moods (maybe in treating them as gods?)… I am infamous for doing this. If he is in a bad mood, it puts me in a bad mood. I don't know why. If he needs a pity party, there is no reason that I have to be invited!
Missy, 36
Married
Tennessee
1. These were interesting chapters, it's a bit fun to have 'inside knowledge' about men.
For most of my life, men have been gods. Especially my own father and then husband. As I grew up, I realized my dad had flaws, but he seemed nearly perfect to me – he was a pastor and I saw him at the pulpit and in our home…there was consistency, authentic faith, fun, motives as pure as can be, even when failing.
I thought the same was true of my husband and lived to serve him. I thought that having a man like my dad would promise the home-life I had growing up and so I tried to do everything my husband wanted or asked to please him. It was never enough and I wore myself out trying to cook, clean, pump him up, look perfect, etc. He was verbally abusive, manipulative, selfish, and eventually involved with other women. I was never going to measure up to his ever changing desires. From this break, I began to see men as devils – none were pure, always hiding their true intentions, always selfish, etc. I've had to replace that lie with truth I've seen and experienced from Godly men (like my father) that yes, real men, Godly men do exist. There are men who can be trusted.
There was a time when I let my husband's mood define me. I allowed his skew of spirituality to determine how I would worship. I had placed my husband as a god and sought to please him more than the One True God. I am sorry to say I have lied, hurt people and failed to stand for truth because I was more interested in pleasing my man and keeping the peace.
2. I see men's insecurities when they get sarcastic. When they act over-confident or prideful and seek to dominate rather than connect. Yes, I totally related to the concept of men withdrawing and women clinging.
3. I have experience in desiring both omnipotence and omnicience. Obviously, if he would do things the "right" way (ie: my way) it would all be so much better! I've learning A LOT about my inability to control and have had to really release this…and it is an ongoing thing to re-learn and process.
Most of all, I have struggled with desiring omniscience. Since discovering first pornography, then another woman, and yet ANOTHER woman…I have become fixated on knowing the truth – the WHOLE truth. Each time I have been told, "That's all," and each time there has been more. Through counseling, I'm trying to trust and learn that God will reveal what I need to know – and He has – but it is so hard to not become a crazy spy, stalker in my quest to know truth. My own pride does not want to be made a fool in this way ever again.
So yes, do I struggle – absolutely. And I'm learning, releasing these to Christ.
Gods for sure. This totally made sense to me and I have noticed it in so many of my relationships. I also definitely struggle with the wanting/having to know everything. And then finding out stuff I shouldn't and not being able to handle it. I used to read my husbands email all the time while he was a pastor and he didn't want me doing it. I learned my lesson when I read something that I just couldn't handle and deal with. It was not something I should have known. I still really struggle with wanting to manage and know everything about my husbands life. I also struggle with wanting older father like figures in my life. I look to guys on staff at our church like they are Gods and desire them to take care of us. I need to look to my heavenly Father for this and only him.
To my husband:
I'm vowing to work on giving you less control over me. You are not God, and I have treated you that way for TOO long. Some of that is due to how I think about you, but some of it is also due to how you expect me to behave towards you. So you will probably like some of the changes, and not others. But I hope (if I can do this) the outcome will please you.
So . . .
1. You are not in control of my emotions. I don't have to feel the way you think I should or be unhappy just because you are upset with me. I don't have to like the people you like, or dislike the people you like. I don't have to appologize for being sad, or being tired, or having for having emotions in the first place. Because emotions are NOT caused by PMS, they are part of who I am.
2. You are not in control of my value. Your oppinion of me is just an oppinion. It is not who I am. Being over weight is not a sin. Thinking and acting like a woman is not a weakness. Growing old is inevitable- for me AND you.
3. I will not accept responsibility for things outside of my control. It is not my fault if the computer is slow, if the kids are getting on your nerves, or if you misplaced something. And while it is my duty (and pleasure) to satisfy you sexually, it is not my fault if you lust after someone else.
If I'm not enough for you, that's your problem, because I can only be what I am. I can be a better me, but I will still always be ME and I will never be any more than that.
Love, your insecure woman
Durant, Ok
40's
Married
.
hmmm, I guess if I have to choose one, I would say "gods". I don't like to think that I would ever view them as either, but it's probably actually a little of both.
2.
I think men's insecurities are usually based on how they are providing for their family. which would be how they are doing as a husband and dad.
I think women's insecurities are usually based on how insecure we feel in our looks and also on how we feel we are doing as wife and mom.
I re-read the chapter, and realized that men have insecurities about their looks, too, of course I did know that!
Both genders can have insecurities related to jobs, and both genders can also feel insecure if we do not feel loved and appreciated. Actually, after re-reading the chapter, it seems that both genders have insecurities about most of the same things. Maybe, for some reason, we let ours cripple us more. (?)
3.
I have never thought I was a controlling mom or wife, but sometimes I want to know everything that is going on in their lives and sometimes I wish I could fix things for them or keep them from getting hurt.
Please pray for me as I begin leading this study next Wednesday night.
I'll just apologize right up front that this is my first comment on the book. I've been reading right along with you though!
First of all, I have just been baffled by something and have to share. When I went to the book store to pick up my copy, there was not a shred of insecurity lingering over me as I picked it up off the shelf. In fact, I was so tickled to get it that I promptly marched on up to the counter and had a delightful conversation with the clerk about how much we both love you and all your work! Rather loudly, I told her about this group and wasn't the least bit insecure in doing so! It never occurred to me until I started reading on this blog that that alone would cause insecurity for some!
Yesterday, however, I took your book along to read while my daughter got braces put on her teeth, and I found myself almost slyly reading it and not wanting anyone to see what I was reading. I finally came to the conclusion that this insecurity thing is weird, and this situation so vividly described my life and my insecurities. When I'm in a comfortable setting (Christian bookstore, my own home, around other same-size or larger people than me, my office, my church), I'm much more secure in who I am and don't even think about the possibility of being insecure! But put me in a public setting, with people who are tiny, or people who may not think like me or believe like me, then all the insecurities come rising to the surface.
In answer to your questions on chapter 10 …
1. Personally I've always had a healthy view of men, but I've been blessed to have a wonderful father and a pure start to my marriage 25 years ago. There are a handful of vivid memories from my childhood where boys could have easily taken advantage of me, but praise the Lord, they are just that — memories — and nothing that resulted in a bitterness towards men in general. God's blessed me with an appreciation for submissiveness because I've seen it modeled in my life and have found freedom in submitting to God and my husband and their authority over me. It may not always be easy to let go of something, but when done with the right heart, it is freeing!
2. I totally agreed with your assessment on men's vs. women's insecurities! Men may appear to have it all together and not deal with insecurity as much, but it's just not true. Life has had a way of really shaking up the men in my life for the last little while, and I have found myself interceding on their behalf and just pleading with God to give them affirmation and additional strength in their low times. They are just as human and vulnerable as we women are.
The doctor's waiting room didn't seem like a very good place for chapter 9, so I'm going back to it now — here at home, quiet and private and with a cup of coffee. Can't wait!
Jacki
Hi Beth and everyone,
Ok, here we go……*gulp*
1. gods or devils? Can I say, BOTH? Some men are one, some are the other – but the point is that I tend to see them in the extreme, and not as they really are…human beings who struggle like we do.
2. The quote from page 181, "I want most to be loved even if I am wrong or fail. I fear unforgiveness." rang through my head and heart! I completely feel that way and honestly, I asked my husband if he wrote that! That is so US!(He said it wasn't him but it got a really interesting conversation going…)After reading this chapter, I began to understand that men and women really do struggle with alot of the same things, although they get processed a little differently.
3. Chapter 11 was a rough one for me. Here's what resonated with me: The "devil in a blue dress" comment hit me broadside. Never heard it put so pointedly before. And if I had, I certainly wasn't healthy enough to receive it. I, too, was abused when I was young. (Praise the Lord, this is a safe environment to share these things! But it breaks my heart to know that so many of us went through this….)
To be truthful here, I grew up to be somewhat of a monster. I won't really go into it, but suffice it to say that I was dangerous not only to myself but to others around me. Men became the enemy. And men became the "god". (thus the "men are gods AND devils" perception).
And now you know why my blog name is "Redeemed". Jesus bought me out of a slavery that would have ultimately destroyed me and those I love. That "blue dress" doesn't fit anymore…hasn't for a long long time. Jesus took that old rag and gave me a new "wardrobe"! As you so lovingly taught and reminded us, I wear strength and DIGNITY.
Jesus slayed the monster, and He is my Knight in Shining Armor. He is the Hero. He is the God. Men are just brothers in the fight.
Becky
Owasso OK
married
40's
Rene
40’s
Claremore OK
Married
First I wanted to thank NICCITSE for recognizing my suggestion to write out the prayer from last week. It Tickled Me Pink (love your posts as well) to see my name on here outside my own post!
Men are gods to me thanks to my mom (who can probably thank her mom). We completely catered to my father. We were Catholic so I am pretty sure that is mixed up somewhere in there as well. Beth said on page 199 “Remember, we don’t have to love something for it to be a god to us. All we have to do is DEVOTE OUR MOST VALUABLE MENTAL ATTENTIONS TO IT.” (Caps Mine) Those two sentences fit in well with my promiscuous teenage years and my two marriages.
My husband is an alcoholic and he’ll be happy to tell you that he is. When I met him almost 15 years ago I just knew I could fix him. With my guy however, it wasn’t Sonic cups on top of pamphlets or tracks I brought to him but beer cans. I completely identified being omnipotent. Like pg. 199 said – I devoted all my mental attention to him and his alcoholism. Stormie Omartian helped me through this with her book about praying for your man. It’s hard to hate someone when you are praying for them and oh how I hated him. It got me OFF focusing on his addiction and just letting go and letting God. He’s still an alcoholic and maybe always will be – it’s not my deal anymore – Praise GOD!!
Before I shut up though I have to tell you, Beth, that the two statements on pgs. 213 & 214 were HUGE to me. “..the helper is the one doing all the work. Simultaneously, the one being helped lazily lapses into the mentality of a victim of his or her own weakness and all the while gets to be the center of a strong person’s attentions. What a deal” and “there is something about unhappiness that is working for them. It could be the attention they’re getting or the excuses they’re milking. Some won’t do what it takes to liberate themselves because their particular form of bondage provides a momentary respite from real life.” I am so grateful to my Lord and Savior that it’s not me in his shoes. I am glad I am the strong one – all because of Jesus, not of my own doing.
I've been thinking about Question #2 and this morning it hit me. Men fear not being respected and women fear not being loved. I think a lot of our insecurity differences come down to these two different needs.
Sarah
20s
married
The more I read this wonderful book, the more I have come face to face with my past. It's been scary to come to terms with what happened to me and only a few people know (not any details, just that I was abused.) I give God praise and the glory for helping me understand why I have acted out the way I have. That in order for me to heal and to except the blessings God has given to me I have to take back what He has already given me. My dignity, my strength, my security, they are mine.
I guess I have thought of men as both gods and devils. I couldn't live without one, then I couldn't stand the one I was with. They were all users and abusers. I have even thought that of my husband. He is the most understanding patient man to be sure. I know he feels like he lives with a crazy woman at times. Ha Ha!
I am believing in God and with the help of this study that I will heal and become what the Lord has made me to be. I can't wait, it's going to be an amazing journey!!!
Bravo to Anonymous today at 9:15 am. You put into exact verbage what I have been trying to think for the past couple years! Thank you so much! Praise God for this blog – you all are saying so much that helps!!
I have been thinking and re-thinking the whole thing about
viewing men as gods or devils!
I posted yesterday & since then I
couldn't stop thinking about this.I
have just been crying, and knowing how my insecurities made SUCH A FOOL OF ME!
I was a victim of abuse ,at age 14 by my youth pastor, I was thinking now that seeing him as a god is exactly what brought me to that place. I was SO insecure and felt
so unloved by my dad, that I was
a walking target for anyone who would show me affection. Then it happened: The man who I viewed as
a god , a man who I trusted and looked up to more than anyone else I knew, came running to this secure
girls aide. And not in a good way.
My heart aches still! Why wasn't I
strong enough to RUN! This man had
a wife & two children. The one who was teaching me about God was being
my god!When all this was exposed and had come to an end, it was life as usual in my home. None of it was never dealt with or talked about.This was late 70's and most
people didn't seek counseling.I don't know why! My parents just
bought me a puppy & I guess they thought that would make everything safe & secure for me.
I'm thankful to God making me safe and secure after a long road
of insecure choices!I'm Celebrating
11 years of being free from the
insecurities that caused me to
seek my security in men.
I am now safe and secure in the arms of my FIRST LOVE! My one true love, JESUS!
Thinking about these issues just
made me go back a bit and ponder. Felt some pain, but in a
good way. Knowing where I've been & what God's delivered me from makes me run, even faster now to
My Lord, My Deliverer, any time I
have a trigger of insecurity.
Thank you Beth for your transparency & for encouraging us
to do the same, so we can put it all out before our Father & deal
with it with HIS TRUTHS!!
I've been reading and following all along, just haven't been able to post my comments the last couple of weeks.To fill in that gap, I just want to say that the word by word break down of Prov.31:25 in Chapter 8 was by far the most enlightening thing for me. WOW.
1. I tend to view men as gods – worthy of all my attention and service.
2. Men seem insecure in what they do, women seem insure in who they are.
3. I used to want to know it all; it took many ugly revelations before I realized that the junk I was adding to my baggage wasn't even mine to carry.
Seems to me there are way more of us that are insecure then those of us that are totally secure. With that…to own security and have it show in public — it is often misunderstood by the majority out there who don't have it. I mean, if I don't feel the need to act on something striving for that omnipotence or omnisience to gain a percevied security in a situation, my insecure friends and family think I don't care enough – because if I did I would be trying to do something about it!! Does that make sense? It's kind of like the peace of God that transcends all understanding (Phil. 4:4-9). When you have it, you don't get anxious about things, but then when you don't get anxious, people who don't have that transcending peace wonder what in the world is wrong with you that you aren't worried about the situation.
Or am I being insecure about that too?!!
Nancy / 40s / married / SC
Kristi
Rogersville, TN
30s
married
1. For the biggest part I've viewed me as devils, especially growing up. It seems like every time I think of a time I viewed a man as a god his true colors came out and showed just the opposite. Most all men in my childhood were abusive to someone I loved. The ones I gave my love and trust to really let me down. This made me spend most of my life thinking there wasn't 10 good men on the entire face of the earth. I am however working on trying to view them as neither. This goes up and down for me.
2.I think men and women insecurities are very similar. I feel the main difference in how we deal with them. I do think that when men use the don't mess with me, it only adds to women's insecurities of what's going on.
3. omnipotent – I have in my head if I could just make my husband get his life right with God we would have the perfect family. I want him to be spiritual leader of our family, to be involved in church. He chooses to sleep in every Sunday and show absolutely no interest in church or living his live for God. I just want him to be the passionate man of God that I know he could be. God's timing is one of the hardest things for me.
To: Anonymous "To My Husband"
3/19/10 9:15am
Oh how I want to jump through this screen and hug you! You are SO worthy and right in all that you said! I am praying for you… just remember that you are clothed with Strength and Dignity! HE gave it to you! It is yours! No one can take it away! Love you!
@ Rebecca @ 12:08 pm,
I am so sorry to hear of your deep pain. When you don't feel like there's a point to going through all the actions in the day, getting out of bed is nearly impossible and very painful.
In my time of deepest, darkest depression, God showed me that I didn't believe anything would ever change but no matter what, there is always hope.
I'll be praying for you!
I saw a lot of my younger self– making men into God's– in these chapters. However, I don't recognize a lot of captivity in this area of my life. I am looking forward to the coming chapters because most of my insecurity comes from other women.
Until then, I have begun seeing some of my husband's behavior as stemming from his insecurities and he's been very interested in learning what I've been reading in So Long Insecurity.
Thanks Beth for writing this book! I am overwhelmed reading all the comments of freedom and brokenness that our siesta blog is experiencing.
To Kelli @3:29
My heart goes out to you and your husband as you wait anxiously. God has not blessed us with a family yet, and it's been almost two years, but we're trying to be patient.
I will be praying for you through this process, and for your peace of mind. The God of heaven and earth cares for you and is intimately involved in all our heart issues. I fully trust that in His time he will bless you with another perfect little child. He is new every morning.
Hugs
In order to try to keep my own thoughts straight, I haven't yet read any other comments 'til I get my own spilled out here.
1. I wanted to refute ever having thought of men as gods or devils. But on reflection I can remember spending many years pushing to perform in whatever arena I found myself in order to gain the approval of the man in my life at that time. I suppose that makes him a god of sorts, because as you said, focus is fundamentally worship.
2. Interestingly enough, I think I watched this one play out in our home last night. Our 16yr old son was unusually quiet at dinner. I began my third degree, questioning every area I could think of. He proceeded to skulk off to his room. I told my husband that I thought we should go try to find out what was wrong. My husband said to leave him alone. As I prayed for him, I imagined all manner of difficulty he may be having and that we were being poor parents to not be supportive. Later he emerged with manner slightly improved. He admitted to having suffered some worse than usual bumps and bruises in practice and having a bad headache. I grinned at my worst-case-scenario thinking and handed him an Advil. Crisis averted.
The whole withdrawal thing reverberated loudly with me. My instincts are to talk something to death, whereas my husband seems to know when words can only complicate.
3. Omniscience really rang a bell. You almost quoted exactly one of my husband's favorite comments: "Don't ask questions you don't want answers to." Over 20yrs of marriage (thank You, Lord) have taught me that when my husband isn't ready to talk, I really will NOT benefit from trying to muscle him into it. Never heard the "tree" comparisons before, but, boy were they dead on.
Thanks for the insight.
Kathy B
H'ville, TN
40's
married
For Anonymous: To my husband posted March 19th @ 9:15
My heart aches for you. I have been in your shoes. I have felt what you have felt. God answered my prayers before I even prayed them. He is THAT big! He worked on my husband in ways that I never thought possible. God changed my husband's heart after 13 years of being married to him and I will pray that He will do the same for you. We cannot change someone's heart on our own strength, but on God's, miracles happen. In the meantime, stay strong and convicted in what you wrote and pray. He will hear you. Hold your head up to the sky, God loves you both.
I have been a bit behind in my reading, but have just finished Chapter 9. Oh, how this prayer resounds so clearly what I want to say to my Father. I thank God for giving these words to Beth to help so many of us in reclaiming our dignity and strength which can only come from Him.
As I wrote today's date in the blank on the statement at the end of Chapter 9, receiving my dignity back, I realized that today is the 10th anniversary of my dear earthly father's death. I haven't recognized the significance yet, but know God has a word for me in this timeliness – and I have asked for Him to reveal it to me.
The verses from 3/6/10 blow me away. The Word has such unending comfort and wisdom. My cup overflows!
Nancy
married
late 50's
Houston, TX
Mary
Illinois
50’s
Married
1. Well this takes me back to what my “sin of choice” was in my past. In the book Beth said, “…we don’t have to love something for it to become a god to us.” I learned at a very young age, like grade school, that boys, men can be manipulated and moved in my favor, BECAUSE I was a girl, woman. I had all the garbage that leads little girls and teenagers into the pit of bad choices and sin. Bad examples or none at all, physical abuse, dysfunctional family, a dad that was not there emotionally, controlling mean spirited mother and a child (me) that I believe somewhere along the road had her spirit broken. So down the road of men as my god and challenge, and toy, I began with no clue how far satan would take me. I was also naive enough to believe that somewhere out there was my knight in shining armor that would come riding through the mist in the forest on the white horse and swoop me up into the Happily Ever After Life. And on top of everything I LOVED and still LOVE being a WOMAN!! Through all my “Mary Messes”, I never once dislike being a woman. And to my wonderful amazement and through the MIGHTY POWER of God, I finally met and discovered that Jesus was my knight on the white horse that would swoop me up into a life of forgiveness and healing, and love that is supernatural and eternal. (Rev. 19: 11-16)
2. Men’s Insecurities-well in my day to day observation they do not talk about them. I am not sure that they would even know they have any. Ha! I do though believe that their insecurities are more connected to their identity and what is valuable to them. And the earning their manhood was an eye opener to me. Chapter 10 was very informative to me and I will be sharing it with my daughters and asking our men about insecurities in their own lives. That should be interesting!
3. Oh yes, I have definitely wanted the “power” and to know “everything” about everything. Not a good idea! Does NOT work and here I am reading this book and taking serious notes!! Thank you again Beth for helping all your sisters in the awakening of this pitiful pit of insecurity that many of us are in and teaching us how God can restore us to authentic security.
Married
40's
California
Men, like women, and all human beings, desire to be valued. They "see" that as respect. No wonder Ephesians 5:33 commands wives to respect their husbands. Not natural for us! "They must earn it…"
Omnipotence recognized the conviction there! So glad God has taught (teaches) me to be dependent on Him. I don't need to criticise, teach, correct, manipulate all the time. Liberty is wonderful! Grace sets free and God's power is beyond all we can ask and imagine.
PS We adopted 2 children to add to our biological 2. Growing up the middle of 3 sisters I was adamant not to add any girls to our family. I had been so twisted by manipulation growing up. We ended up with 3 boys and girl (now 13) youngest. Grateful! God knows what we need to need Him more. I needed to focus more on being a princess and well since the inheritance study, my daughter has on her wall, "If the crown fits, wear it". Joy oh
Secure in Christ, moment by moment, Jackie
1. I think I would go with both.
2. not much difference.
3. Neither of these resonated.
I am sorry for these brief answers.
I found all these questions so hard to answer.
Blessings,
Michelle
Vermont
married 40's
1. I tend to go middle ground with treating men overall as gods or devils, but with my husband it's definitely as a god. I was young and immature when we married, but I felt like he could do it all. That eventually led to me wondering why he married me in the first place. We've been married for 10 yrs and sometimes those thoughts try to creep back in.
3. These two chapters have had the most profound affect on me so far. I spend so much time worrying about what my husband should change that I fail to realize I have just as many issues as he does, if not more; so the omnipotent person is me. I can't tell you how many times I've showed him where to put his dirty clothes, the proper way to step in and out of the shower or the reason toothpaste comes with a lid. I've only started realizing those attributes are what make him who he is and I really don't want to change that.
Salina, married, 30's, Hindman KY
Beth,
Chapter 10 and 11 were amazing to me. I never once thought that my husbands anger, frustration, withdrawing, etc could very well be connected to insecurity about something. It may not be the answer all the time, but it helps me to not automatically assume something about him, but instead look at his reaction to things differently.
I can relate to what so many women have already posted, so I'll try to keep it short. I basically wanted men to meet my insecure neediness. My security was wrapped around the response I would get from them. Even today, I am like the man who wrote on page 193 and his relationship with his wife. That is where is struggle a lot!
*********************** a side note Beth
I'm about to view your March 17th Wednesday's with Beth show. I called my 16 year old daughter in and said, "Look how cute that black and white top is with that cute black sweater & jeans!" It's so much fun to see how you piece things together. You are amazing. My daughter said, "She should have her own clothing line!" I agree!
Oops…so forgetful!
Married
40's
Round Hill, VA
Ok – so how timely and quite funny is the Lord? Since we are examining our insecurities, He allowed me to go to work one day when I TOTALLY forgot to put my makeup on! I rarely go without some make up on my face. The only thing I had on was mascara (I know, I know…how INSECURE) and when I realized this I thought "Ok – do you turn around and head home for a quick splash of makeup or do you face the world as the REAL you?" I chose to take the lesson and faced everyone that day with the real me! It was quite freeing actually. Honestly, no one really cared to examine my face and if they did, no one cared to comment…..HOORAY. So long insecurity! I actually laughed at myself later to think that I would be so "important" an issue to others that they would take the time,energy and thought to notice if I had makeup on or not! I amuse myself daily. God amuses me too – I thank Him for the lesson.
SO LONG INSECURITY!!
Ali
Dublin, Ohio
30
Married
1) Definitely as Gods. Sadly, even though I am happily married to my dear husband, I still find myself flirting with other men to gain their attention. I cringe even typing that.
2) I find it fascinating that many of my physical insecurities are reflected in my interactions with other women. But my husband, on the other hand, doesn't ever "dress up" or "put on make-up" just to hang out with the guys. Why must I get all gussied-up just to hang around a bunch of women??? Makes no sense!
3) Omnipotence! I am a control freak. Gosh, I could use a lot more work in this area . . . I'm just beginning to scratch the service of this one. Yikes.